Wednesday, March 14, 2007

Discernment

A while back Kim posted this article on Discernment. In that book she made reference to a book that someone I know recommended that I read.

At the time, I had felt a check in my spirit about reading it. I've learned to listen to that "check" as it keeps me from reading things I aught not, even if at the time I have no earthly clue as to why I shouldn't read it.

I forwarded a link to that post to this individual.

This is the initial response I received
With regards to the books I suggested you read, I agree with the assertion that these are not theologically sound books. I go to a church that is not always theologically sound. I listen to music that is not always theologically sound. It is my opinion that there are some good thoughts in these books, so when I read them, I let go of that which I disagree with and glean the good out of it. The book 'wild at heart' has some good thoughts into the minds of boys/men, and while it does not depict all men, it nevertheless does have some good ideas.
And this was my response back
I guess I wonder then, knowing that something is not theologically sound, why would you deliberately expose yourself to it? Particularly if you are reading to learn from it.

I can understand fiction, who cares, read whatever you like as long as you don't find it negatively influencing your life and witness for God. BUT from a book that you purchase in order to learn and grow from? Why purchase something that is unsound, if there is better stuff out there on the market?
1. seems like a waste of money - like why not get more bang for your buck and purchase something that is more theologically sound
2. seems like you are rewarding a poor author by purchasing an insufficient book
3. seems somehow wrong to encourage someone to read a book to learn and grow from, when you know it is not a theologically sound book

I just thought you might find it (the post) interesting reading.
It certainly helped me understand why I felt this "check" on my spirit in regards to reading the book(s).

Just as I wouldn't continue to go to a church that had really bad theology.
Just as I wouldn't continue to listen to Christian music that taught bad theology.
Just as I wouldn't read a Christian fiction book that has bad theology.

God gives me these "checks" in my spirit for a really good reason. Protection. :)

If it has the label Christian to it, I have learned to expect a whole lot more from it.

It's way too easy to say I'll take this point, but that point which is sorta connected, I won't take.
Or this premise which builds to that premise is wrong, but this premise over here is okay.

Where do you draw the line?

I'm glad that you are able to glean the good out of it. But aren't you at least a wee bit concerned that some of the "not so good" and the "downright wrong" won't influence you in some way?
Further Communication from this individual
Thanks for your thoughts! I hear were you are coming from, and the basic question becomes "how does one deal with those one disagrees with?" How far do you take it? I have read stuff from 'focus on the family' I didn't agree with, do I therefore stop reading their material? Should I support their ministry? I don't agree with some of the things 'world vision' does, should I stop sponsoring a child? Do I reject all worldly teaching as wrong because it is not biblically based? These are difficult questions to answer. I'm sure you remember having to read things at _______ for the exercise of practicing discernment. Many of the books I read are not totally theologically correct, so for me the question is ' what can I learn from this?' , or 'what do I think about that?'. With the book I suggested, the author, while his theology may not always be correct, does have some interesting thoughts into the minds of boys. Boys do have a natural tendency toward conquer and overcome (or destroy) much more so than do girls. How many girls are drawn to 'daredevil' (maybe even dumb!) actions compared to boys? I understand and appreciate the need for theologically sound books, but they can be hard to find, and we also need to consider who is making the review of a book. What if you disagree with them on some theological points?
I have to admit, I didn't know what to say. This bothers me. I still haven't responded because I do want to make a good response.

I talked with my hubbie about it, and he said....hmm... you're not wrong in being bothered, let me think on this some. :)

Then he came back with.... what bothers him is that there is no line drawn between big theological differences and the little, the differences are being equated and they shouldn't be.

And as I've taken time to think on this a bit, I agree.

The person with whom I have been communicating with is not drawing those distinctions.

For instance, I can read something from a person who firmly believes in adult only baptism. Not a problem, even though I don't agree with the stance, I can somewhat understand where they are coming from, and it's not a salvation issue. But someone who denies the death and resurrection of Christ...a different story.

I love reading sci-fiction/fantasy. Just love the genre. But there are some authors I don't read because they try hard to redefine the Christian God, and I find that bothers my spirit, and causes me to think about things that I don't need to waste my time on.

I won't recommend those books to other readers.
If I read a adult-baptism only author and find it good to read and refer others to, I will let them know the authors stance ahead of time so that they can decide if they can or even should read it.

I won't just say.. read it, it's a good book and you'll learn lots from it.
If I read a book and find lots of stuff in it that I can't stand/tolerate/agree with, then I won't recommend it to others even if I glean something good out of it.

I don't know, I do feel bothered about it.
I just don't understand the concept I guess. Why read something that you know is filled with errors, when there are other good books out there?

If you want to know how the male mind thinks, well... you don't have to read a Christian book to learn that.....there are good books out there... I'm sure of it (even if I haven't looked for them).

If you want to know how the female mind thinks...well...find a good solid book, Christian or not, and read it. Or talk with a bunch of women. Or ... whatever.

Why expose yourself to bad theology just because the author says something interesting? Isn't it a slippery slope to be on? For if their thinking is faulty in one area, doesn't it lead that some of their other hypothesis are potentially wrong as well?

I just tend to avoid stuff that is wrong in big ways, and I don't understand the "overlooking" the wrong stuff, and then recommending that others read it too. I don't get it. I probably just need to think on this a bit more. :)

Your thoughts?

8 comments:

jen said...

I have a number of books in my library that I wouldn't recommend to anyone. I only have them for reference into some of the church trends that are going on. I have discerned that the books are not sound, and therefore they do not affect me doctrinally.

I have an extraordinarily diverse library, and I am in the process of cataloguing it in Library Thing. There are books I will not be listing because there is a Library Thing widget on my blog which shows a random book from my library, and I don't want anyone to stop by and think I am endorsing books like the Purpose Driven Life or similar.

I think there is value in reading some of these books if only to be able to refute the claims they make to the undiscerning readers you may come across. But reading them wouldn't be for everyone.

We all need to pray for discernment about everything we choose to put into our minds. God is faithful! And it's not a bad idea to check with people you respect about certain books. That's what I do in many cases.

In my opinion, the very best way to be discerning about what you read is to make any reading secondary to the Word. When the Word is your main feast, and prayer is constant, God allows you to see through the vain philosophies infiltrating the church.

Annette said...

Sometimes I think I should be more willing to read books that I know I won't agree with, if only so I know what everyone else is talking about. But I don't. My thinking is so easily led "off" that find it better to guard my own faith.

I have books in my library where I don't agree with everything said in them, and some books that I read and I think...something is off there but I don't always know what. Not bad in that it does drive me to consider the bible further. what does it say about thus and such. AND if it still remains hidden I can drive my hubbie batty and say hun... what's off with this? (like he always has time for that!) :)

Do I recommend them? Not to just anyone. Those who I know are strong in their faith with good discernment skills... sure...but I warn them ahead of time that there are things in the book that are a bit "off". But to new or weak Christians... definitely not.

My desire is to guard the faith, not hinder or weaken it. I figure my hubbie is so good at discernment that he can read those other books and he can make the defense and I can rely on him to teach me what I need to know if I'm faced with questions from others about questionable stuff.

So far it's working for us. :)

Anonymous said...

I read a lot of books I don't agree with, Annette - I just wouldn't recommend them to someone else.

I read them so that I

1) can understand a topic.
2) can understand another's point of view.
3) can isolate a certain thought - perhaps different than mine - and then clarify what I believe.

Yes - I need to be strong in what I believe, and I need to KNOW what I believe...

But if I AM strong - reading the book gives me a broader perspective and better understanding.

I don't usually buy the book - but if I DO buy it new - I will just resell it when I am done unless I want it for reference. (That's in regards to bang for the buck.) :)

But I'm very honest about my reaction - if I were to do a book review I would say exactly what I thought. I couldn't recommend a book to others - not knowing the strength of their knowledge or conviction.

If I've already studied a topic - I don't usually feel the need to read the book, even if someone recommends it. There needs to be a purpose.

I HAVE read "fad" books like TPDL and Wild at Heart...because I DO want to know what people are talking about. And they do have some good food for thought in them. Sometimes. :)

jen said...

I HAVE read "fad" books like TPDL and Wild at Heart...because I DO want to know what people are talking about. And they do have some good food for thought in them. Sometimes. :)

I haven't really found any good food for thought in most fad books. The PDL movement in particular is rife with new age thought and psychology, not to mention business strategies which have no place in the church. The misuse of many different translations to prooftext the authors ideas is aberrant.

And I haven't read Wild at Heart, but I've read enough about it that I'm convinced it's twisting the Word into something it isn't.

When I read these types of books, I don't glean anything of worth out of them. My heart is simply heavy that books like these fill the bookstore shelves while one is hard pressed to locate trustworthy books on the true foundation of our faith.

Annette said...

I have to admit.. I have no idea what the TPDL books are. No clue whatsoever.

I do trust though, that I know enough that when people say... thus and such talks about this, what do you think? I know enough that I can counter the argument without having read the books myself, or if I can't, I can say, can I get back to you on that .... and then I can do further research from the bible, and/or ask my hubbie about it. Both are excellent resources. :)

I just dislike heartily wasting my time reading something that should be teaching me something and all it does is sow seeds of discord or questioning within. Don't like that. If I want to waste my time on a book, there's lots of good fiction out there I can do that with.

And deep down,I just don't get it. Although I can somewhat understand others desires/abilities to do so. Just not me I suppose.

Anonymous said...

TPDL is The Purpose Driven Life.

No, not much food for thought in that one. :)

But...I'll tell you why I read that one. We had people in our church, family and friends who loved it and read it. I needed to be able to say to them: "This is what is wrong with it. This is why you shouldn't buy into it."

I didn't invest much time in it - it is more of a skim read.

I'm not saying someone HAS to or SHOULD read these books. I think your reasonings are perfectly good and fine and logical! I was just answering the question of "why" someone might read them, even if they knew they wouldn't agree with them.

jen said...

Holly:
Exactly. If you have the discernment that can help others to see through the fallacies in a trendsetting book, by all means, that's the only reason to read it.

Annette:
I'm not advocating that just anyone read just any book. If you feel a check in your spirit about a book, you should get advice on it, or simply put it down. I think your method is working well for you. These things can be too time-consuming. :)

Annette said...

Jim and I talked about it a bit on the way to Toronto this morning ... he said he's skimmed TPDL, didn't like it, but if more people in church were reading it he would have read it more thoroughly in order to have a good and ready answer for folks. But for the most part he's glad that I don't like to read "junk". (well...other than my total thing lately for Robin Hood books - fantasy fiction) VERY good books to just escape with...

Thanks for your reassure ladies that I'm not a lazy person for not reading this stuff. Sometimes I wonder if I am, but then I think... God gave me this check in my spirit because I asked him to BECAUSE I read stuff that still makes my head spin ... so I aught not throw it back in his face should I? :)